The second audio track of my conversation with Gord picks up after a short pee break and a refreshing of drinks. If you’re lost, you can check out the first part by clicking on my name and scrolling down. But chances are, you’ll be lost anyway.
Gord: Okay, where was I? Uhhh…brainwashing! Back in the day, World War II or I or whatever it is, thay studied exactly how to manipulate an individual’s brain, so they can make them do whatever they want them to do.They studied it. I don’t remember learning what the outcomes of these tests were, but I do know that some of those tests were successful. There’s lots of different methods of brainwashing individuals. When you look at a commercial, it’s filled with lots of nice, bright shiny pictures, they last for 30 seconds, and what it’s trying to do is get you to buy the product. How do you sell the product? To sell the product you have to convince the person to purchase that product. You have to cater to the lifestyle they want. You have to show them a lifestyle that would suit them. So you make a car commercial that looks like the lifestyle that they would want. When they buy that car it makes that individual exude the lifestyle that they wish to portray to the rest of the world.
H: Right.
G: So they buy the car, they spent the money. The companies get that money. That’s brainwashing. It’s people being brainwashed is what commercials are all about.
H: And the people never realize that their lifestyle hasn’t changed at all. They just have a car.
G: Exactly, all they have is a goddamn fucking car. Maybe it has bells and whistles. Maybe it runs better than this other car, but big fucking deal. It just meant that their advertising budget was bigger.
H: Yeah, and the thing is there’s more levels to it than that, too. You have some people that are less susceptible to it than others, obviously. But those people who aren’t susceptible to it are susceptible to other things like peer pressure, for example. They go to school, and everyone they know is wearing the Gap clothes and all of a sudden, they find themselves as an outcast because they’re not wearing them.
G: So the trick to capitalist culture is to be able to infect a certain percentage of individuals that are susceptable to a particular form of advertising. Once they’re infected and they purchase the products, then..
H: It spreads like a virus.
G: And the smallest percentage of people are the ones who don’t have TV’s and don’t give a shit what they look like.
H: Yeah.
G: And they’re fully content to live without these said products.
H: It’s always really been fascinating to me, because I’ve never really given a shit. I’ve always…uh…It’s so…all these companies portray a lifestyle, and they try to sum it up with a slogan. “Everybody in Gap.”
G: “Drivers Wanted” by Volkswagen.
H: “I’m Lovin’ It.”
G: I love driving! (laughs) And “I’m Lovin’ It,” exactly. Or “Just Do It.” (adopts fake look of stupidity in his eyes) Yeah, yeah, that’s my attitude.
H: (adopts same) I’m totally a “Just Do It” kind of guy. One time, I went rock climbing. I’m a wild man.
G: That’s my attitude, so I’ll buy that product.
H: I’ve actually seen people, and I’m sure you have too, wtih the Nike “swoosh” tattooed on themselves.
G: I’ve heard of it, and I’ve seen people like that in Adbusters.
H: I can’t believe that anyone would…it just seems so ludicrous to me.
G: I know. That’s good advertising. Good advertising is manipulation.
H: Yeah, absolutely.
G: I’m all for manipulation, it’s just that…
H: (laughs)
G: It’s like this, I used to think that the world is messed up and it needs to change the way that it thinks, because it’s full of sheep. North America is full of sheep and that’s just it. That’s where I was going wrong, I was trying to convince people not to think that way. You can’t convince people not to be sheep. You’re either a sheep, or you’re a leader. So, if you can think outside of that box, you’re not going to be able to convince people to think outside of that box because there’s too may sheep. What you can do…
H: (sly grin) Put them in a better box?
G: Manipulate their surroundings enough so that your manipulation is better than the rest of the manipulation they have to deal with, which is why it’s a losing battle. You’ll never win against them. They have more money. Corporations have way more money, they have all of those television stations. They’ve got them in their pocket. That’s what they do. They have to cater to the advertisers. To be able to create a revolution is to create a better way of life. The only way to be able to do it is to have enough money to be able to manipulate the populous. To steer them. To be the lead sheep. To be the sheep dog that puts them into the pen. A pen that says be kind to each other, don’t step on other people’s toes to better improve yourself. That’s not a good way to live. A good way to live is to be polite. You know? To…uh…I have my own way of thinking about it and…I don’t know…every major religion has talked about it. I’ve come to the conclusion that it’s impossible to change the way people think. You have to actually show them a better way to live in a way that is more powerful than the way they’re taught and shown every single day of their life.
H: Well…
G: Cause it’s a pretty arduous task.
H: This is a question that I…We’re getting into the territory of talking about changing the world.
G: Yeah.
H: And you hear a lot of…obviously, in this day and age, particularly in the age of Youtube, you get a lot of people self-righteous kind of pseudo hippies who are sitting there about how they want to incite revolution and change the world. Overthrow the government, you know? They think that they’re going to accomplish this by going to the G8 summit, and protesting, which is a meaningful gesture, but it doesn’t accomplish anything.
G: It’s good to do, but…
H: It doesn’t accomplish anything.
G: It’s all flashy bells and whistles.
H: It’s exactly the same thing as like throwing a flaming piece of shit through a Starbuck’s window. It’s a really great message, but it doesn’t accomplish anything.
G: Exactly.
H: I’ve always figured there’s only two ways to affect change, or ways that change is meaningfully affected, anyway. Either there’s a societal change, and people generally understand that something is different or something is wrong. We shouldn’t wipe out of the Indians. We shouldn’t…
G: But that would only come from a dramatic social occurence.
H: I think in that case, it’s a gradual…
G: Yeah, it builds up until the straw that breaks the camel’s back.
H: I see it as two different options. It’s either slow change for the better, or things hit so rock bottom that they have to change. If you paralell that into a government, you need to have the government overthrown and a period of anarchy, before…
G: A revolution.
H: Yeah, before you instill a better government.
G: There was a French revolution, they stormed a prison.
H: The storming of the bastille.
G: Yes, that’s the one. The people were hungry and they needed food, so they stormed a prison, because the prison inmates got more food than the public did.
H: And that’s true even today, but some people don’t realize it. There are people starving to death on the street, while prisoners cost many thousands of dollars to keep in jail.
G: They’re all a product of the system in the sense that voters aren’t so much individuals, but people that live somewhere. People that have an address are voters. If you don’t have an address, you’re not part of the census. That doesn’t make any goddamn sense. There’s millions of people living on the streets, and the only thing that they can afford to do is find food and scrounge up enough leftovers from our horrible society to survive the next day, and nobody listens to them because they’re crazies. That’s all a product of our society. You’re crazy if you don’t want a pair of Nike shoes, you’re crazy if you don’t want a nice car. If you don’t want a house.
H: That same thought, you’re crazy if you don’t follow the norms. I had a screaming match, an absolute screaming match with my mom, because I didn’t give a shit, and I wasn’t outraged, at Janet Jackson’s nipple at the Superbowl. I said “It’s a nipple. It’s a piece of the body that I have, that you have, that everyone has…
G: Everyone on the face of the earth.
H: Who the hell cares?” But there’s this societal thing that we should all be ashamed of our bodies. I’ve always thought that it came from the Bible, that it was some kind of Christian thing. But if you actually read the Bible, in the Garden of Eden, they only started to feel bad about their bodies after they were cast out. So one would infer that the logical thing would be not to be embarrased by that, and if people wanted to be more like they should be, they wouldn’t be. They’re taking the message completely backwards.
G: They’re misinterpeting it. A lot of people do that. A lot of people that are put in power, that are put into a place where people have access to what they’re saying, mininterpet everything. So everyone who listens to them, believes them, because they’re sheep. And it’s not their fault that they’re sheep.
H: I’m going to admit something to you. I love the Bible.
G: I think it’s great.
H: It’s a fantastic work of fiction.
G: (doubtful, noise as if he’s about to object)
H: It’s better than Lord of the Rings. It’s better than fucking…you know…what do I have for an example here…It’s better than all the Tom Robbins novels. It’s so imaginative and vivid, but in no way should it be taken literally.
G: It shouldn’t be taken literally, I agree. My mother’s always pushing me to read the Bible, but I’ve been through so many Bible Studies, and so many youth groups and so many Sunday school classes learning about all the different stories of the Bible. And every thing that I’ve taken from it, that everyone else seems to…it seems to escape them that each and everyone of those stories that you hear about in the Bible are about love. And if you love somebody, and you follow the golden rule, which is in the majority of the religions out there, then you’ll lead a full and rich life. If you can actually master the art of forgiveness, then you’ll lead a really full life.
I don’t have one ex-girlfriend who I’m not friends with. There’s not one thing that I can hold against somebody. If I meet somebody and their initial impression leaves me thinking of them as a useless piece of trash, I’m not going to hold it against them if they later redeem themselves. Everyone on this planet has some sort of redeeming characteristic. Even if you don’t have any friends, you still have a redeeming characteristic, but you can’t live on this earth and have a friend without having a redeeming characteristics. It’s either your charisma, or your tenacity, your gumption, your get-go, everything that it could be, every individual has some sort of redeeming characteristic to them.
The Bible, to me, is nothing more than a collection of stories about love, and to truly love, you must be able to forgive. Anyone that has been married…well, it’s kind of hard to talk about that in this day and age. The classic way. My parents are still married. The majority of the people on my floor in residence had parents who were still together, which was bizarre when the modern family is a family that’s split. My kids are growing up in a modern family. I wouldn’t say that it’s all my doing, but I don’t know how much about what my counterpart thought about it, or thinks about it. But there’s no way that she’s not going to be a good friend and a great mother to my kids. Some people aren’t. They’re spiteful. They would lead a lot healthier life if they were more forgiving of people. If they realized that every single human being on this planet makes stupid, dumb mistakes, but at the time, you can’t tell. It’s so hard to tell at the time, but we all live a certain number of years.
We can look at life and say, “wow, a lot changed.” But on a day-to-day basis, not a lot changes. How can you say that in a year, a lot changes? There’s so much that goes on in an individual’s existence, so much on their side of things, everything that they’ve ever come across in their entire existence determines what’s going to happen next. How they deal with it. What they do in this particular instance. You can’t hold it against them, so forgive them for this mistake. Forgive them for misinterpteting a particular instance because of whatever they’ve dealt with before. You know that you wouldn’t like somebody to hate you forever for something you did. So don’t hate people forever for something that they did. That’s what the Bible is to me. It might be a work of fiction, but to me, that’s neither here nor there.
H: The point I was making was that it should be seen on the same level as, like Aesop’s Fables. They’re there to teach a moral. You don’t read Aesop’s Fables and think “I hope I find a lion so I can take a thorn out of their paw.” You shouldn’t read the bible and think “I should hate gay people.” It’s funny, we’re coming to the same conclusion, but taking vastly different ways to get there. I come to it from a vastly different angle. I’m very into the idea of the cosmic joke. The idea that most people, their entire life is just a struggling, grasping effort for meaning. They want to mean something, they want to have a meaningful existence. But nobody’s life is meaningful. You might make an impact on the Earth for, at most, a couple of hundred or thousand years, but then you’re forgotten. And who the hell cares? Anything that anyone has ever fought for, or loved…
G: It fades into obscurity.
H: Anything that anyone has ever fought for, or died for, or lived for, or loved for has all been totally meaningless in the grand scheme of things. Once you come to the idea of that, then you think “Jesus, if nothing is meaningful, if nothing is important, than what is important?” What’s important is that you, and the people around you that you care about, are happy.
G: That’s exactly it.
H: And there’s nothing more to it than that.
Next week: More on the lost art of forgiveness, and cartoons in the modern era.



on September 27th, 2007 at 7:36 am #
I read this last night after everyone had gone to bed, and had to try really hard to not laugh out loud and wake everyone up.
So uh, about this usurption thing you keep bringin’ up: WHATSA MATTER?! CAN’T HANDLE THE HEAT?! But no for seriously I swear your day was some other day or something, like, thursday or whatnot, and I had post-dated a mazillion articles for this day. =/
on September 27th, 2007 at 8:23 am #
/me realizes that is not much of an apology or solution but may work on refining it later.
on September 27th, 2007 at 3:36 pm #
“it’s amazing that it never occurred to him that maybe the Canadian cars aren’t overpriced so much as the American ones are under priced.”
Regardless of who’s what is over/underpriced, when the value of a dollar changes, prices should change accordingly. With the two dollars being practically the same, why does Random House still charge Canadians subtantially more than Americans?
Economists will tell you that it’s a trickle down thing, and that it takes time for the prices to react. But my dad is an economist, and let me tell you, they’re full of shit.
To me, it’s just big American companies not giving a shit about anything. I was trying to write a story about this, but nobody from Wal-Mart, Random House, or any car dealership or large internationally trading company would accept my calls. Bastards.
on September 27th, 2007 at 8:34 pm #
You know, you are totally right and I wasn’t even thinking (surprise!) and am a huge jerk for trodding all over your day. You even had unexpected nice words and I am now abashed further. Do you ever blog about things you care about that aren’t in Spanish? Aside from uh.. here?
on October 1st, 2007 at 10:54 am #
I’m sorry my nice comments were unexpected, I usually just try to be mean to weasel, I have no proverbial beef with people that (usually) post on their own days. I would ask if I could have Fridays since you are leaving, but Tuesdays are better for me. I used to blog about things I cared about in not Spanish but I ran out of things to say. One post per week is enough and there is a much better chance that people will read it and/or comment on it here than at my personal blog, so I more or less retired. I think there is still a link on my name if you want to see old ones…